Konrad Werner: Is the economy real?



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Bit tiresome

The idendification of a few subsidies for a few industries and the fact of the third sector doesn't mean the government can control the economy. That would be a command economy, and these all failed. Selective government intervention to prop up demand in key sectors or make coal affordable (the wind turbines aren't all up and running yet) isn't proof that the government can steer or even predict economic growth. Why make a comment on a subject about which you clearly know less than nothing?

Andrew Smith more than 7 years ago

You're not really Smith, are you?

That all sounds ideological to me. I think governments just put money where lobbyists tell them to.

Konrad more than 7 years ago


Let's assume they do. That still doesn't add to the argument of your article. The volume of the money which the government injects in subsidies and incentives isn't enough to control an economy or even steer it. As for ideology, everyone who believes anything has some form of ideology. Your article is full of the big I. The question is whether you can add any (pertinent and related) facts to demonstrate your case, which you didn't. And yes, my name is Smith. With a surname like that, I don't need a pseudonym:)

Andrew Smith more than 7 years ago


But I still don't understand why we talk about capitalism like it's so great, like history proves it's the only way that works, when half the economy seems to be state-subsidized anyway. When apparently the only way to keep it going is to pay people so little that they need benefits.

Konrad more than 7 years ago

Getting tiresome

1) "But I still don't understand why we talk about capitalism like it's so great."

I don't.

2) "like history proves it's the only way that works,"

History has tried (often radically) and failed to find an alternative. I'd be very interested in any suggestions you make (you don't)

3) "when half the economy seems to be state-subsidized anyway."
IT'S NOT!!! This is a verifiable falsehood!

4) "When apparently the only way to keep it going is to pay people so little that they need benefits."

In 2012,1.3 million people recieved such assistance compared to 29 million in work.

You are right to ask questions about the way in which the economy is organized. But for goodness sake, use some verifiable facts and stop making sloppy exaggerated assertions which just don't stand up.

Andrew Smith more than 7 years ago

Ok, about a third then.

Oh my god, I've wanted to have this debate with someone for so long. I'm sorry it's so wearying for you, but there's so much I don't understand. What about the Abwrackprämie? How is that not fundamentally an admission of defeat? If the only way to keep the car industry going is to literally pay people to buy new cars? And not any people, but people who've ALREADY FUCKING GOT CARS. What is the point? Why not at least pay people who haven't got cars to buy new cars? Or why not just admit that we don't actually need any more cars? Why do we need to keep everything going like this? Why is "growth" so important? Aren't we just pumping steroids into a dead horse?

And 1.3 million people is loads! That's a lot of people! And I bet those people are doing jobs that are really important - like looking after old people in care homes or something. We need those people, but there's no way a real capitalist society could actually support them.

I just feel like we've accepted capitalism on a moral level, as an idea, which I totally do as well, I think people shouldn't be lazy and should work because the alternative is despair and madness and suicide, but all we're really doing is treading water in an empty ocean until we get tired and drown. And the government has to keep plugging the gaps and propping up the economy just to keep the whole show going. I just think we should admit that capitalism is really no more than a powerful moral idea to ward off existential emptiness, and not this amazing practical thing that has solved all the world's problems.

Konrad more than 7 years ago

capitalism's over

even really really right-wing people admit that capitalism has totally failed and isn't the best way of running our world. it's blatantly over. I watched the Fox News people slagging off Russell Brand & blatantly the black guy thought Brand was right but couldn't admit it to himself

Jacinta Nandi more than 7 years ago

Are you all drunk?

This ist argument, it is gibberish.

Blingmaster more than 7 years ago

I'm sorry.

The egg-nog is going to my head. But why is it gibberish? WHY? Why do all these industries need all this state-funding and the banks need to be bailed out by taxes? Why do we bother?

Konrad more than 7 years ago

The economy, the monster that never is and never will be...

I can't think of any other reason as to why the 'state' - which is a nice sounding euphemism for the political class/elite; controls every pillar of the economy than simply the obvious; control, control, control and a little more control and more control. They've got the 'economy' by the balls, which is essentially, any country's balls really. Once you've got a man by his balls, you damn sure got him at his delicate part of his body, where it hurts the most. Threaten to or press a little bit, he will do as you ask him to.

That's what the political class/elite, through their cat's paws, the economy/finance ministers or under whatever other appropriate titles, does to the rest of the country and to keep everyone in checks by, for instance, giving periodic gloomy economic forecasts; enough to keep joe public's mind occupied with worry of the 'future'.

Ganja more than 7 years ago

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